Close call for HemiSnake

[HemiSnake]

So I thought tonight was the end of the HemiSnake... 86 miles on the odometer and the f$@#ing engine catches fire while going 40 MPH on a road about 2 miles from my house!!! Don't worry, I'm okay (I know you were all asking yourselves that question), but now realize why I need to make 100% sure the fire extinguisher is always in the car. I had it in there every other trip but left it out this time because I was working on the carpet last night and forgot to put it back in. You guys should have seen me on the side of the road with a huge white cloud of smoke beating back the flames with my jacket - unbelievable! Figured I had 5 years of my life tied up in that build and I was willing to go down with it. (Sensationalized slightly for dramatic effect -- I'm not that stupid. But when the guy and his wife pulled along side me - as I was figuring out who to call first - and pointed to the fire coming out of the vent above the drivers side header, I wet myself.)

Turns out, the braided oil line from the engine to the cooler was not up to spec and separated from the fitting under pressure. Sprayed all 9 quarts of synthetic oil everywhere, including the headers, which is why it caught fire. Lucky for me, the guy who drove up happened to have a bucket of water in his trunk??? Go figure!!! All this happened right in front of Dave Duerson's house on route 22 in Highland Park. Anyway, the car looks fine, and with some luck I'll get it back together in time to take it to the dyno (Mroz) on Thursday afternoon.

In all seriousness, I debated posting this message for fear of all the ridicule I will get, but hopefully others will read this post and heed the safety warning about having an extinguisher in the car at all times and how quickly these things can turn on you.

- Mark
http://www.mtdesign.com/cobra/

[Ibr8k4vetts]

Water on a oil fire You are lucky it didn't burn the whole car down to the ground

[Rick Parker]

[IMG][/IMG]
You are absolutely correct about an extinguisher in the car art all times. I did not have flames (and have no idea why not!). This gasket on the remote filter adapter was improperly seated and let go at triple digit speed. It looked like the smokiest F1 blowup you have ever seen. I looked in the mirror and could not see anything! Oil was ALL over the bottom of the car, but luckily didn't get on the tires. I dodged a bullit much like Hemisnake.

[Blas]

Soooo....Mark...
What's new?

Glad to hear your not on the verge of another 5 year build....
What would it have been this time....a JET engine?

[RallySnake]

Mark,

Good save! Thanks for letting us learn from your problem. I used to run oil lines to the cooler and remote filters. I got tired of dealing with hose problems. Now my system is as stock as possible. Keep it SIMPLE!

Paul

[turnpike boy]

Hemi, must be a rite of passage for some of us.

I had just finished my build, had about 15 or 20 minutes of run time on it (NO road time), and fired it up to show a friend how good it sounded. Satisfied, he left, and I figured I would run the car until it was good and warmed up. I was out of the car and about to close the hood, to move it back into the garage, when a HUGE ball of orange flame shot straight up, about 6 or 7 feet, out of the engine bay.

I dove back into the car, shut off the key and fuel pump, popped up and started blowing for all my worth on where the flames seemed to be coming from. The whole time I was huffing and puffing I was thinking "where's the fire extinguisher, you a$$hole?!" Back in the garage, of course.

Cause? Stewart Warner had supplied one of their dandy extruded nylon oil pressure gauge lines, which I stupidly installed, and it just literally popped open at the seam, spraying oil on the now-very-hot headers. Shutting off the car stopped the oil flow and put the fire out - not that I knew that at the time. After my knees stopped shaking, I ran out to the local speed shop and got an Autometer braided-steel line, with swaged ends.

You ain't alone, bro.

[double ugly]

I had a similar incident in a B&B. The nylon oil pressure guage line split at the closest point to the left front header. It was spitting a steady stream of oil on to the header. No fire but the extinguisher was ready if needed. I replaced the line and put a wrap around the line.
John

[tpiini]

Wow! You guys have had some serious fun! Thanks for sharing. Now I know I won't be waiting to install the extinguisher!

[Badman]

Mark,

I am sorry to hear about your car, but more importantly, glad that you were not injured. You can always build another car but believe each of us is unique and irreplaceable.

Based on your near fatal catastrophe, I want to purchase on fire extinguisher for my car. If anyone else is interested, maybe WCCC members can receive a group discount by ordering a dozen or more on a single order. Anyone interested?

[Flittleton]

Mark,
Really, we are all glad to see your ok! Glad to hear the Cobra is ok.
If anyone is interested in the fire extinguishers, we have them for sale. These are the chrome small extinguishers that you can bolt to the tunnel or aft bulkhead. We have plenty of them, they are going for $50.00 plus shipping. Let us know if anyone is interested.

[Jerry Clayton]

In addition to the call for fire ext. ,this should serve as a wake-up call to evaluate the cars for sources of potential failures---of course nylon lines are unacceptable for plumbing of any type(in my opinion) and any other lines should be pressure checked--and all components must be compatible--hardware store and AN fittings do not mix---

A cobra with all the external lines to remote coolers and filters has multiple potential sources for failure and the 1800 degree headers are an ignition source for anything flammable--

In the various cars that I have seen come thru this shop, the plumbing is an area of major concern as is the e;ectric fuel pump wiring and lack of a total electrical shutoff--not lack of shutoff but that it wasn't a total shutoff!!!

So - Please--take a look at your cars, and your buddies car--if you see areas of concern, speak up--and don't be offended if someone else points out an area of shortcoming in your build--they are probably doing it because they care about you


Jerry

[Blittleton]

Hemisnake, I'm glad that you are ok. We always encourage our customers to get an extinguisher. Here is the one we sell. If anyone is interested we sell them for $50.00 + Shipping




Good point Jerry. Good information..

[hot427cobra]

Fred (Flittleton) & Bill (Blitteton),


At first I was confused by seeing two similar registered user names and wasn't sure who was who until I visited the www.gcperf.com web site.

What can you tell us as to what these fire extinguisher use for their fire suppressant ingredient? I have heard, which I can't say is totally factual, is that some chemical based extinguishers are very corrosive to electrical components. That is why some fire suppressant applications are better off using halon, which in an open car may have a difficult time starving out the oxygen in the air. I realize that having some corroded wiring is a small price to pay when considering the total loss of a vehicle. I would just like to know before hand what type of product I would be using before purchasing one of your units. Thanks!

Mark

[Greg Curtis]

No ridicule here Hemi, thanks for posting it may be a heads up for someone else and save them a headache. Most times we make a mistake and get away with it but every once in awhile it bites us as it did you this time. As someone else said thank god you didn't lose the entire car. 5 years is a good sized chunck of our lives! Good luck with redoing the engine and take care!!

[Blas]

Halon is being replaced by another product these days....I don't remember it name right now...(Halotron I think)
Any cabin mounted fire extinguisher should have metal not plastic attachment hardware. Most tracks don't allow the plastic hardware....
Standard chemical fire extinguisher's are a disaster in a car fire, the fine powder (Sodium Bicarbonate) gets into everything.

[Jerry Clayton]

I don't like the idea of anything loose in a high performance driving machine--in a violent maneuver it will get loose and beat hell out of you--these are all high performance machines--treat them like it and put a real race car fire suppression system in 'em--yep, costly but not considering the $$$ and time involved

Jerry

PS--and start eliminating possible sources of failure--especially those of flammable liquids---I've been on fire and alltho at nite it is spectacular for onlookers, it ain't fun

Jerry

[jeffko]

Good post Mark. This is too serious an issue to ridicule you about. We'll save it for later.

Although I have an extinguisher, I also had some potential problems with fuel delivery that Jerry pointed out. I had a fuel filter in the engine compartment that was more designed for low pressure before the pump rather than the 12psi after the pump as I had it.

I have a question about the cut off switches. I have one, but if the engine is still running doesn't the alternator power the system even if you used the cutoff?

[Blittleton]

Mark,
Short on doing a thesis on this, you are correct. Wiring could be corroded and your aluminum car would be at risk. Monammonium phosphate and Sodium Bicarbonate have corrosive properites, but under the circumstance of a fire I'm persoanally not concerned at the time of corrosion. I think in an open engine compartment fire you will have a better chance in smothering the fire with an ABC type. Halon type you are exhausting oxygen, if you can't remove the oxygen, or heat you will still have fire.

You will also have all metal hardware for the attachment of this canister. I'm really not an expert on this but have been around enough aircraft and know that both are used.

Bill

P.S. By the way my name is spelled Bill Littleton

[lineslinger]

In my "other life" I worked as a friefighter. One call that we constantly answered was car fires.
To this day I carry a fire extinguisher in my every day ride. I have assisted three people since and each time I managed to help save somebodys ride from a complete meltdown or worse.
One thing you have to remember when dealing with an engine fire is you really don't know what the fuel source for that fire is. Most times the fuel source is multiple. A shorted out electrical wire is burning off insulation, or has melted through a fuel line or is resting against a flammable synthetic material in the engine compartment. Think about how much plastic is in a modern engine compartment these days.
Think twice before you open the hood with or without extinguisher in hand.
TURN OFF THE IGNITION FIRST.
By opening the hood you are accomplighing three things, one is access to the heat source. the second is you are venting the same heat source...giving it somewhere to go and INCREASING its "respiration". Third is you are supplying FRESH oxygen to a vented heat source which can easily turn into a blowover or a semi-explosive or explosive (depending upon fuel source) situation.
Any time I go after an engine fire with a extinguisher I hit it through the the grill and from underneath FIRST, the fire draws the retardent chemicals up into itself, then CRACK the hood and hit it again and keep hitting it until all flames are supressed. Wear LEATHER gloves (No synthetics) if you have them, a gasoline flareup is almost instantaneous, you have no chance to pull back and turn your face away, most chicks don't like the "hairless" look, no eyebrows, eyelashes, mustache or beard.
An engine fire is an extremely dangerous situation, gasoline, plastic, oil, and big amperage from the battery, think about what you are going to do and the order in which you are going to do them. I saw more than a few do gooders climb into an ambulance with second and third degree burns simply because they were trying to help. Here is a good link to use when considering what extinguisher to install in your cobra.
http://www.h3r.com/products/c354ts_hv.htm
Mark

[hey,littlecobra]

I was instructed to spray the extinguisher into the hood scoop first, if I saw a fire. Would you say this is a correct procedure??? This is a scary and dangerous topic.
Kristen