Nightmare of 427 provenance

[AC Ventura]

So has this car has been built up from a genuine discarded damaged chassis, which came from a car which was given a new Autokraft chassis, but kept the original chassis number CSX 3272? And does it follow that this (red) car is of contemporary construction, sitting on the former cars original, but repaired chassis, which no longer possesses aforementioned chassis number?

http://www.duncanhamilton.com/cars-f...lby-cobra-427/

Here's what seems to be the same car (check out the 3 rivet chassis tag)......... wearing a different reg, just to clear things up.

AC Cobra 427 MK III SC Specification + Side Oiler 427 For Sale | Julien Sumner Fine Motor Cars

Is this case of unscrupulous multiplication, outrageous pricing, or am I missing something?

[twobjshelbys]

Hmmm, maybe this car is the subject of the second (maybe third) most repeated topic in the forum? Use the search function for CSX3272... And a Google search will bring you over to SAAC.

[moore_rb]

The truth is that there is only one CSX3272, but unfortunately, this car learned how to master Heisenberg's uncertainty principle, and now exists as two quantum-entangled particles on opposite sides of the Atlantic Ocean...

The odd thing is that when you turn the key in either one, BOTH engines start simultaneously...

Multiple requests have been made to Neil Degrasse Tyson to explain the quantum mechanics of this phenomenon; but alas, so far all of our requests have gone unanswered...

Ok, ok, ok...

The car in the US is a 100% re-manufacture (using Autokraft and Angliss components), which was sanctioned by the legal owners of CSX3272, after the car was wrecked in an accident. Under California law at the time- the VIN number and CSX serial number conferred forward to the re-manufactured car.

The car in England was/is a different (and later) re-manufacture, but was actually assembled using some of the refurbished parts from the original CSX3272 (parts that were supposed to be scrapped when CSX3272 was rebuilt following the accident).

How these physical scrap components from CSX3272 managed to break free from the car's titled ownership, and eventually disappear off to merry old England, I'm not sure anyone has ever fully deduced... The speculation was that the shop that did the re-creation of CSX3272 sold these pieces, instead of scrapping them like they were legally supposed to...

So, from a PHYSICAL standpoint- The car in UK actually possesses steel and aluminum that were used in the original CSX3272; but the car in the US is legally considered to be CSX3272 from a documented ownership and title chain standpoint....

There- Clear as mud, right?

This is why I personally prefer the Quantum entanglement theory, myself...

[AC Ventura]

Thanks guys, should have guessed this CSX's history was already well documented, but car is new to me and recently appeared for sale over here....yet again it now seems.
For most of us, it seems it's not so bad when some unsuspecting rich guys gets turned over, but I still don't like it. I'm not saying dealer is dishonest, I don't think he's concealing anything, but asking $500,000 for a replica on a rebuilt old, damaged, should have been scrapped chassis, with not even the right number to accompany it, seems to confer there's something incredibly special about this car. The thing is that some people aren't life long enthusiasts, don't have all the necessary knowledge and rely on the dealer to guide them. This car has done the rounds of several dealers in the UK, then seems to have diasappeared without ever appearing on their sold inventory. Now it's reappeared with the number plate changed......when I bought my MK IV, a car I was knowledgeable about, the dealer also had this car for sale at what was then $800k. They dropped it when the truth became apparent, or at least that's what they said.

[120mm]

Would this be an example of George Washington's AC or Schroedinger's Car?

[mdross1]

How cool would it be for these two cars to end up side by side one day. Would add up to some interesting conversation.

[moore_rb]

Originally Posted by mdross1

How cool would it be for these two cars to end up side by side one day. Would add up to some interesting conversation.

I'm afraid that can't happen... Any time matter and anti-matter come together, they destroy each each other in a violent reaction, and release only X-rays and Gamma particles... Didn't you ever watch Star Trek...?

Seriously now- I suppose your scenario would be the best one for restoring the car's purest provenance and history...

[Moto One]

Maybe the only solution to this (with out ending the world in a little bang) is to demential both cars and return the original chassis to the original body... But would there still be two CSX3272s?

Mark

[Nedsel]

There are some missing facts here, which is leading to some incorrect speculation. The damaged 3272 was considered "spare parts" once the legal owner of the car (and the VIN) chose to rebuild it with new parts in the late 70's. The original numbers were removed from the "scrap" and the leftover parts, including the chassis and much of the body along with ancillaries, were sold to a collector and given a new VIN. But it happened that the chosen VIN was not legally the property of the collector; it belonged to a car that was presumed destroyed back in the 60's under the assumption that no identifiable remains of it would ever reappear. But that car surfaced roughly 16 years ago, and a valid title to it was reissued. That left the car that we suspect was originally 3272 without a claim to the VIN inappropriately attached to it years earlier. The then-owner of this car correctly agreed to surrender any claim to that VIN, leaving the car under discussion in this thread. It is clearly an original 427 Cobra and various clues suggest it started life as a 32xx car, however there are no numbers at all to conclusively prove its original identity. It masqueraded as another car for a number of years and made its way to Europe in the process. Today it has had its VIN removed once again. It is the fault of the former owner who attached a VIN to it that he did not legally own that created the situation we have today, and unraveling it is not an easy or inexpensive thing to do.

[1795]

So what would happen if we placed them both together in a garage and they mated? Would the resulting offspring have more providence than either of the parents? It would have a little bit of CSX from both of them

[Moto One]

It would be a CSX Escort RS... But with 50+ year old parents might have some ECM issues.

Mark