428 water/oil temperature

[bliss]

I was out and about today - it was hot - around 96 - anyway, I've got a 67 428 in my Cobra...mild cam.

At what water temperature should one start worrying if it gets any higher?

At what oil temperature should one start worrying if it gets any higher?

What is the average temperature, water/oil, that is ideal on a normal day - normal meaning around 75 degrees?

Thanks for any input.

[FWB]

i start to get nervous when water temp goes north of 200F

[patrickt]

My FE runs at 85C to 90C, both oil and water, pretty much regardless of the outside temperatures. You should be concerned with your FE's temperature when it is abnormally high as compared to what it usually runs (as opposed to absolute numbers). Some guys over on the FE Forum are comfortable with 225F on a hot day and have been for decades of driving. But for me, the only time my needle has ever even gone close to 100C was when there were fan problems.

[FWB]

100c....i get a kick out of that......why not measure it in kelvin......
or joules......lol

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by FWB

100c....i get a kick out of that......why not measure it in kelvin......
or joules......lol

Smiths gauges.

[FWB]

no i get it....i just find it amusing, to put metric gauges in a car you have here in the US, it would annoy me to no end in my car. but thats the way the smith's are.....
i know i'm a bit odd....but i find it also ridiculous to put any lucas electric components in a car also.....unless of course your looking for an easy insurance claim for a total fire loss....

i just remember having triumph cars and motorcycles and cursing lucas daily. although i never had to replace my zeno diode, or whatever it was called

[kevins2]

I also have Smith's gauges (and an FE) and my water temp stays between 80 and 85c unless idling for an extended time and then it might hit 90c. Could be difference between gauges to what Patrick experiences, but as said - consistency is what to look for. And Fred, it did take a bit to get used to the metric scale, but I don't even think about it anymore. One thing that I find curious is that the Smith temp gauges are metric but the Smith oil pressure gauge is in PSI...

[RICK LAKE]

Bliss It's not that simple what you are asking. Don't know make of car but there are differents with each car.
ERA car have a radiator set at and angle laying back with a air deflector or 2 mini cooling fans. Other kits have a straight up and down radiator which works a little better for air flow. There have been threads about having and no have the small cooling fan in the front of the radiator because of blocking air flow or redirecting it. The fans do look cool running.
Aux oil cooler in the front end of the car, They work well but some work too well and the oil never gets to the right working temp for the best lubing, protecting the internals, and correct temp. A oil thermostat housing is the best way to go to help get and keep oil at the right temp.
Radiators, Some are aluminum and some are Bass/copper. I have run both. I have an 482 all aluminum motor and it heats up to temp in 3 minutes. OIl temp takes about 5-8 minutes to get into it's temp readings I do and a aux oil cooler on my car. The temp reading gets to about 190-200 from track running. Coolant temp is also in the 185-193F readings. I have not checked with a lazer temp gun for correct reading but know the gauges are close.
Thermostat this is and was a big problem I had with my motor. The FE thermostat doesn't flow enough water in my car with either radiator. ( I have a griffen 4 core in there now) I have found that using and a small modifying of a Dodge RB motor thermostat has greatly improved and does a better control of flow to the motor. We are allowed to run water and waterwetter at some track only. I do have the air deflector in the front end and not the 2 small fans. I have other tricks to help get the hot air out of the engine compartment. Heat shields, louvers in the hood and wrapping of the exhaust. Heat in, heat out. getting back to thermostats, The dodge one is 1/2" larger flow hole than the FE motor one. You need to trim 2MM off the out side edge to get it to work in an FE motor. Make sure the bridge top clear both ways. That's it. You will see a 20-30F drop in temp when this big boy opens up. I run a 180F stat. The temp will vary about 5-10 degrees on 100F days. Getting the hot air out of the engine compartment will help keep down temps.
YOur question, You didn't say what oil you are running or what fluid is in the cooling system, Out side numbers, Max 220f coolant temp, Max 240F oil temp, again this is all depending on fluids being runned. This is with a stock oil pans and water pump. Stock pulleys also on the motor. You will have some problems with underdrive pulleys. I have been through the overheating at long idles. 1-1 ratio for crankshaft to water pump is the best. Make sure the belts are tight and not slipping. Roughing up the surface of the grooves helps give the belt better bite. 80 grit sand paper and blow off any film. here is alot more I could cover but I get cut off with long threads. IF you want to talk some more on this, e-mail me here. Rick L.

[DanEC]

Originally Posted by kevins2

I also have Smith's gauges (and an FE) and my water temp stays between 80 and 85c unless idling for an extended time and then it might hit 90c. Could be difference between gauges to what Patrick experiences, but as said - consistency is what to look for. And Fred, it did take a bit to get used to the metric scale, but I don't even think about it anymore. One thing that I find curious is that the Smith temp gauges are metric but the Smith oil pressure gauge is in PSI...

Kevin - what thermostat did you install? I'm kicking myself for installing a 160F thermostat as so far my engine sits right on 80C which is a little cool. I did spring for the HD puller fan unit which seems to be very efficient at doing it's job.

.

[1795]

My '68 428 normally runs around 80 C on the water and in warmer weather about 75-80 C on the oil. Just took a 1,00 mile round trip, with up to 400 miles on 2 of those days. On a couple of the days it was in the low 90's F and the water remained constant, the oil rose to 90 C. I do have the oil cooler in my ERA. I agree with prior posts in that you need to be more concerned with what is normal for your vehicle and be cautious of spikes or excessive cooling.

[kevins2]

Hi Dan,

I installed a 180F thermostat and drilled a small hole, as outlined in the ERA manual.

As for oil coolers, since I don't track my car I don't need it. I installed one to fill the void in the front cowling but cut and capped the hoses just inside the engine bay.

Kevin

[patrickt]

This is an informative thread: 332-428 Ford FE Engine Forum: Why am I overheating? long post

Note that one FE owner writes: 240 degrees isn't hot enough to worry, but you should start paying attention. Just goes to show you that different FE owners have different opinions on the temperature issue....

[PeteF]

A 50/50 mix of antifreeze and water in a 16 psi cooling system will not boil until 265 degrees F. So, technically you have plenty of margin. But, any compromises in the system will reduce the boiling point. Also, you risk fuel percolation as underhood temps rise. I start to worry around 220 degrees.

[DanEC]

Originally Posted by kevins2

Hi Dan,

I installed a 180F thermostat and drilled a small hole, as outlined in the ERA manual.

As for oil coolers, since I don't track my car I don't need it. I installed one to fill the void in the front cowling but cut and capped the hoses just inside the engine bay.

Kevin

I think a 180F thermostat is what I should have installed. I guess I will change it sometime.

Thanks

Dan

[Eljaro]

I have my cooling system filled with Evans waterless Coolant. Using a high flow Stant thermostat (180ºF) and switching on radiator fan at 225ºF through a sensing unit keeps fluid temp 185º steady, except on hot days in trafic jam where temp reaches 225ºF and fan comes on. Temp comes down then pretty fast to 195ºF idling.
Had a Hillclimb (5500-6000 rpm most of the time) last week where oil temp reached 250ºF after a fast run. When idling the engine after that temp went up to 265ºF and came down again when moving. Oil temp stay at about 210ºF all the time under normal driving condition.
Using 10-60 Castrol Edge Synthetic oil.
Changed over to Synthetic from Dyno oil after I saw several times temp climb to 240º.

[lippy]

I have an ERA with their larger radiator. It's filled with 40% anti-freeze and 60% water, with WaterWetter (I normally wouldn't believe in this, but Doug at ERA swears by it and I don't think it hurts). I have an oil cooler but it is capped off and not in use. Oil is Brad Penn 30 weight.

Even at 95 degrees ambient, my water stays at about 190 and my oil at about 185. The only time my water temp rises above that is when I stop the car, and it still never exceeds 200.

[1967 XR7 GT]

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