Metal in oil - now what?

[Texasdoc]

After the broken springs and finally getting the carb running just right, I decided to change the oil. After pulling the drain plug, I noticed some black "fuzz" on the end of the magnetic plug. Then after draining the oil I noticed some tiny silver metallic dust sized particles in the oil. They appeared silver rather than copper. There were no particles larger than what I would describe as dust. They could not be felt by rolling between my fingers. I was in a hurry so I didn't do anything else. I replaced the plug, put on a new filter, then poured in new oil. I am beating my head against the wall with this thing. I've only put about 500 miles on it since the new motor two years ago.

Possibilities I can think of:

1 - bearings. I am using 10W-30 Castro Dino oil. I have a High Volume pump. I get >70 psi when cold, 40 psi warm idle, >70 psi when warm and over 2000 rpm. I *should* have enough oil pressure/flow to protect the bearings. The mains were lined and honed with the ARP studs at the local machine shop. I don't recall the bearing clearances, but they were within the "normal" range recommended by the book I was using for reference.

2 - spring residue. I had two broken springs. One of them was fractured into five separate pieces. Perhaps some of this material made its way down into the pan. I thought that all the spring material was there, but perhaps...

3 - Normal "break-in". Although I have roller lifters and rockers, perhaps what I am seeing is just normal initial wear of this essentially new motor. None of the material is palpable, only visible. Now that I finally have it running well it may just go away (hopefully).

4 - Other failure. Anything. Bad lifter, damaged cam/bearing, piston, ring, head, valve guide. Distributor gear looks fine.

I really don't want to tear this thing apart. I finally got it running after the failed EFI attempt, broken springs, and carb adjustments. No leaks. Starts quickly, idles and runs well once warmed up. Compression testing is good. Leak down testing is good. I guess I'll run it for a bit, drain the oil, send a used oil analysis, cut open the filter, etc. If it still has metal, I'll take off the pan and check the main and rod bearings.

If I end up taking off the pan, I'll probably switch back to a normal volume oil pump. I thought about switching to 0W-20 oil to increase oil flow and decrease oil pressure, but don't think that is a smart choice.

Any other thoughts?

[Three Peaks]

A small amount of metal in fine suspension is fairly normal in a new engine still breaking in. If the chunks were larger, it may be a concern. Did you take your oil filter apart and check the filter material to see what was in there? Most of the metal particles should have been picked up by the filter, only the finest particles would get through or settle to the bottom of the pan (except for large pieces of metal that the oil pump won't pick up.) I don't think I would worry about it, but keep an eye on things to see if it continues. It should be cleaner next time if all is well.

Bob

[1795]

You only have 500 miles on it, probably just normal break-in material. If there are no copper looking pieces and the oil pressure is still good, probably not bearings. You can look in the filter and see if three are any substantial pieces. People who I race with that have had bearing failures typically either see a drop in oil pressure, a spike in oil temp, or both. I would not worry too much at this time.

[Texasdoc]

That's what I'm hoping. I'll drive it a few hundred miles, keeping an eye on the oil pressure, then change the oil and look in the filter. Of course that may take a while now that winter has come.

[blykins]

Just go ahead and cut the oil filter open.

I've had two bearing failures on the dyno. One was a BBC that had a main bearing delaminate and the other was a Pontiac that cracked a rod journal and spun a rod bearing.

Both had perfect oil pressure and oil temperature and the only way I knew something was up was the power was falling off and we couldn't get it back.

Cut the filter open and put your mind at ease.

My guess is that everything is perfectly fine. If this is the first oil change since the engine was built, you will see a fine sheen in the oil that's normal. Every single part of the engine is trying to get to know its neighbor.

To compound that, you had MULTIPLE broken valve springs. They would have absolutely shaken off fine particles from where the broken ends were rubbing against each other.

Cut the filter apart, change the oil, and go have some fun.

[Gaz64]

Agree with all of the other lads input above.

Remember a magnetic plug will only have piston ring/bore material, crankshaft, cam lobe/lifter material etc, in other words ferrous material, so no copper, aluminium, brass, tin, babbit, etc.

Also, some oil filters will open the bypass early with cold oil, which then has unfiltered oil circulating.

Gary

[PANAVIA]

So if the fuzz-- stuck to the magnetic plug, - it is magnetic. -- thereby ruling out aluminum, copper and other things that are not -magnetic.

this could be iron from the block, ring material. -- i agree with the cutting open of the filter and reviewing what else is swimming around.

you can also send a sample of the oil to someone like blackstone labs to see exactly what it is. -- there is a certain amount of fuzz that is expected in a new engine up to about 1200 miles, and it should drop off to nothing.

[Texasdoc]

The oil filter looked fine. Nothing in it. When I replaced the springs, I used a dab of moly on the tips of the push rods. I wonder if this is where the fuzz and/or the shinny specs can from. I'll keep an eye on it for now.

[RET_COP]

Sounds Normal and I have found the same in several new engines.

[Jac Mac]

One problem with any 'metal making' in a freshly built engine is there is no sludge buildup in the pan or valley to entrap the 'metal' so its more likely to be circulated. If this engine had 50k miles on it you probably would not be seeing anything to worry about. Fit a magnetic drain plug and expect to 'see' a bit of 'fuzz' on it for next couple of oil changes, the amount should decrease over the next few changes, if it increases then you do have an ongoing problem. With your broken springs they would have been rubbing away at any contact points making metal in the process.

[mikeinatlanta]

Or... Send a sample to a lab and end any speculation. Would you really consider tearing down (or not) based on opinions of a bunch of guys who (even assuming appropriate expertise) haven't actually seen your oil?