Long block, newbie

[Davidless]

Hi all,
I was looking for some advice on a Windsor 427 for my SF roller almost on order.

At first I was going with a complete turn key full powertrain from one of the reputable builders. Looking at around 520+ hp. Then I came across a ford racing long block (M-6007-Z2427FFT back in stock) for around 14,800.

With most of the parts to finish as a full powertrain I calculated around 25g. I figured I’m more than capable of the completion since most of the precision stuff is done. Mech/mfg engineer here for the Gen V engine (LT4), with excess to a full machine and fab shop my brother has.

What I feel makes me want to go this route is a new updated Windsor block rather than the typical reconditioned out dated one.

I trust the ford people to build a decent LB engine with decent components because I know we do (LT4).

I can request a builder to use a dart or similar block, but think it may be much more than 25g total (full powertrain).

I also realize a reconditioned block is more than strong enough for 520 hp (from what I’m told) but it just bothers me for this amount of $$ I’d rather have an updated modern block, just me I guess. Plus better resale value, God forbid.

My definition of a full powertrain is carb, engine, clutch and trans to drop in, not including other hook up stuff like hoses and drive shaft.

I’m not concerned with a dyno print out because the LB is more than enough for a 2500 lb car, for me anyway.

It’s a winter project for me being newly retired, ie taking a buyout, and to chase women around or better yet, to get my mind off of them, lol.

Am I correct in my thinking or am I totally missing something?

Thanks for the help

Newbie Dave

[incoming]

Just remember that to get that 427ci, you have lot's of different things moving quickly in different directions. From what I understand 302/347 engines don't have a long life. Same with the Winsor based engines over 408ci.

I just got a Mexican block 351 that i'm building into a 393.

I can do that on the cheap. And probably it'll outlast me.

[6TNCRZY]

I went with the ford performance short block, beefy block, revised oiling, 4 bolt mains, Cleveland mains, plus steel crank, H beam rods and Mahle forged pistons all balanced and assembled. I assembled the rest of the engine with better AFR heads and special Comp cam and valvetrain. Engine is amazing, I couldn't be happier.

https://performanceparts.ford.com/part/M-6009-427F

One word of advise, the long block comes with a nice 8" deep oil pan, but you should really go with a 7.5" pan for proper ground clearance. Have fun building your car !

[blykins]

Originally Posted by incoming

Just remember that to get that 427ci, you have lot's of different things moving quickly in different directions. From what I understand 302/347 engines don't have a long life. Same with the Winsor based engines over 408ci.

I just got a Mexican block 351 that i'm building into a 393.

I can do that on the cheap. And probably it'll outlast me.

Pretty common misconception.

I know of a 347 with 100k miles on it.

The 445-460 Windsors also do quite well.

[Danr55]

If you're going to race it, you're approaching it in the wrong direction. You need to concentrate on performance. If you're not going to race it, why do you need 500+ HP?
I can tell you from experience that the standard FE motor is more than capable of exciting any and all onlookers and it looks just fine in the car. If you want a race car, build a small block car and race your heart out. All of that said, it's your car and you should build what makes you happy. Tha afore mentioned suggestion is just the result of many years driving these cars and more than a few regrets for choosing the wrong path a time or two.
I almost forgot that anything you buy for an FE will cost multiples of the same thing purchased for a small block motor. Believe me, there will be lots of things purchased for whichever you choose.

[patrickt]

Let me echo what Dan said. Plus, nothing 'wows' the crowds like an FE under the hood. Even if that FE is really a 390 that makes half the horsepower of a small block in full race mode. If that matters, then keep it in mind.

[6TNCRZY]

Why do you need 500 horsepower ?
BECAUSE IT FEELS SO GOOD !!!

[Streetwize]

I have a 427W I built myself that I am extremely happy with. 10.5:1, Factory block, a mild F/T cam that I specified (232/237 @.050) and very well ported Trick Flow Heads/Windsor JR manifold. It has a self-tuned 800AVS Edelbrock carb and 1 7/8" headers with 3 1/2" collectors. It has a Tremec 5 speed with 3.50 gears. Makes over 500 HP and revs over 6000 but peak power is around 5200. the car is very balanced and fun to drive and will cruise smoothly in over drive at 70MPH at around 2100 rpm.

The key to me was to have wall-to-wall torque and the power is really all the chassis can handle on the street.

I have been building motors for over 45 years and strokers for over 30. You can spend a lot more on forged cranks and rods, 4 bolt main aftermarket blocks and roller cams but in my opinion, most people will never be able to load the engine hard enough or hold the throttle open long enough for 90% of owners to make that extra expense really be worth investing into a Cobra. The rod ratio on the 427W (4.17 stroke) doesn't like high revs (piston speeds over about 4200 fps)...but it doesn't really need them either, but the occasional weekly WOT blast is fine, like I said you really can't load a cobra engine very hard due to it's light weight and lack of aerodynamics which induces lift instead of downforce. A good oil pan with 8+ quart capacity and good cooling and good oil and fuel pressure is really all you need,

There are many ways to skin a cat but for me I love the 393-427 Windsor strokers ability to emulate the FE like torque and throttle response of a vintage big block muscle car combined with the light weight and balance of a smallblock (the one that won nearly all of the important races in Shelby history) Cobra.

i build a motor for a target horsepower or controllable power to weight ratio. I build a solid reliable shortblock and generally put the majority of my "go-fast" dollars into the Heads and Manifold porting. On a stroker I generally like a smaller port with optimal mid lift flows that will achieve that HP level, and then I Cam it to make the broadest/flattest and most usable torque curve that will still get me to that target HP....more like a road race powerband than a peak/HP drag motor....because for me the fun of a Cobra is really pulling through the gears, not powershifting down a drag strip with tight ratios and/or a high stall converter. For a cobra to be set up properly for Drag Racing the suspension has to be set far from what is optimum for handling. Anybody who has really drag raced their Cobra hard knows you need to crank more stiffness into the right rear to counteract the twist unloading primarily the left front, most of us just countersteer it but that costs ET at the track. that not just cobras , that's pretty much any decently powered RWD car that hooks the tires hard.

[eschaider]

Originally Posted by Streetwize

...The key to me was to have wall-to-wall torque ...

This ⬆︎ is what it's all about — and you want it everywhere, all the time!